Some ideas for my new Tropical Paradise

[Justin]

The name is subject to objection from various contributors on Gary's Retirement Thread.

I go back on the 29th (landing early on the 30th), and will be there for a week. I'm going to try to plant a bunch of stuff while I'm out there. Because of the short time I'll be there, I'm trying to do most of my planning before I go, based off of the pictures that I took a couple months back. I'd be interested in feedback on my ideas.

For the circle in the middle of the driveway:

* Colvillea racemosa in center

* Etlingera elatior around perimeter

* Heliconia psittacorum around perimeter

On the southside of driveway:

* Adonidia merrillii (pre-existing)

* Sadleria cyathoides

* Dypsis “Orange Crush”

* Aechmea blanchetiana

Along the street, where the current hedge is, from "closest to the street" to "closet to the house":

* Areca vestaria hedge (to replace the existing hedge over time)

* Clinostingma samoense

* Ficus dammaropsis

* Heliconia gloriosa

* Heliconia rostrata

North of house, near the property line

* Heliconia longissima

* Mucuna bennettii

* Kentiopsis magnifica

* Lemurophoenix halleuxii

* Kigelia africana

* Clump of Pinanga insignis

[Justin]

Right outside front door:

* Johannesteijsmannia magnifica

* Alocasia sanderiana

* Cibotium menziesii

North of the house, near the property line:

* Carpoxylon macrospermum

* Clinostingma samoense

* Cyphosperma balansae

* Dictyocaryum lamarckianum

* Dypsis “Orange Crush”

* Kentiopsis magnifica

* Physokentia dennisii

* Pinanga insignis

* Satakentia liukiuensis

* Wodyetia bifurcata

* Burretiokentia vieillardii

Farther up the North property line:

* Replace hibiscus with Corypha umbraculifera

* Replace poinsettia with Delonix regia

* Replace Jacaranda with grove of Kerriodoxa elegans

Area around the carport:

* Kerriodoxa elegans

* Marojejya darianii

* Add Pelagodoxa henryana by tree ferns

* Zingiber spectabile

* Etlingera corneri

* Replace Puka Tree with Samanea Saman

[Justin]

Even farther east along the North property line:

* Couroupita guianensis

* Butea monosperma

* Ficus auriculata

* Actinokentia divaricata

* Calyptocalyx albertisianus

* Clinostigma harlandii

* Kentiopsis magnifica

* Kentiopsis olviformis

* Hedyscepe canterburyana

* Lemurophoenix halleuxii

* Mauritia flexuousa

Area south of shed:

* Dypsis “Madagascan Foxtail”

* Wodyetia bifurcata

* Wallichia disticha

* Heliconia gloriosa

* Amherstia nobilis

* Bahunia kockiana

* Gloriosa superba

Area north of shed:

* Grove of Licuala ramsayi

* Grove of Licuala grandis

* Ceiba Pentandra

* Alstonia angustiloba

Around Banyan Tree:

* Iguanura elegans

* Johannesteijsmannia magnifica

* Kerriodoxa elegans

* Pelagodoxa henryana

* Salacca magnifica

[ariscott]

Man.... if you are planting in Hawaii, don't plant H. psittacorum. Stick with gingers in the middle - maybe some alpinia? Or even beehive gingers... Costus or Tapeinochilos are nice too, if it is shady enough...

Plant more exotic heliconia like She Kong, xanthovillosa, you get the picture... Be careful in planting Mucuna, it will escape to the trees at the back.

Regards, Ari

[Justin]

Last but not least, the South Property Line (the right side of the picture, near the Banyan Tree) (I don't have a better picture of this, unfortunately)

* Pseudophoenix vinifera

* Hyophorbe verschaffeltii

[Gtlevine]

I love Namby-Pamby land. I love your idea of Covillia racemosa in the island, those are gorgeous trees in Hawaii. One of my objections to the gardens in Hawaii is there is not enough use made of the many tropical flowering trees available and there absolutely should be.

Gary

[ariscott]

I think you should plant ALL handkerchief trees... And I do mean ALL... not just Amherstia.

Gary, with your passion for trees, you should be in the tropics!!

Regards, Ari

[Peter]

I would suggest some type of smallish, flowering tree(s) with nice scented flowers close to the house, such as Stemmadenia, Tabernaemonta, etc... And I would also suggest some type of Cassia- bakeriana, javanica, or a rainbow shower, also close by to look at. Then again, I love flowering trees. As for palms, I would also think about planting multiples of certain species, to give the garden some continuity, instead of trying to get one of everything. Repeating Clinostigmas samoense comes to mind. Also, even though I don't garden in the tropics, I've heard that gingers and heliconias can really take over, so if you're not going to be there all the time, you might take that into consideration. Someone from Hawaii can certainly correct me if I'm off base here. Exciting project!

[BS Man about Palms]

I only know palm names, can't help with the rest.. If you have one week, you better be running off the plane with a shovel in your hand and cash flying out of your pockets!

[ariscott]

Heliconias is ok, as long as you stay away from stricta & psittacorum. They can get out of hand very quickly and you have to keep them under control all the time as they can pop up everywhere. Most torch & beehive are ok too... they just need a clean up every now and then. Some costus though, like indian heads will get out of hand. You also need some giant alocasia, I think for that tropical look. Nothing beats alocasia to scream tropical with their huge leaves... Aussiearoids is my alocasia expert here...

Peter is right, I have been planting a lot of scented flowers around the house. I have gardenia, jasmine, and of course plumeria.

Regards, Ari

[pogobob]

Hey Justin, I own the copyright of the name "Namby Pambyland" I see how clever you think you are by changing the name to "Mamby Pambyland". My attorneys will be contacting you real soon! I may forgive you though if you plant a syagrus abreojos in my honor I'll even give you some seedlings! You have an oustanding selection of plant material in your plans. This will rival all the other great gardens in Hawaii!

[Walter John]

The only gardeners in OZ who would call their garden by that would be members of the Wiggles.

Strongly suggest an alternate name, unless

[Tassie_Troy1971]

Justin

Looks like a great selection of palms to plant . Did i miss it or have you not considered the beautiful Satakentia liukiuensis !.

Must be an amazing climate if you can grow Hedyscepe there as well as all the other tropicals.

[aussiearoids]

Etlingeras in the circular bed will do ok , as the concrete will stop them spreading to much . They will need regular trimming of leaning canes . A collection of several different ones would be great , from deep dark red , pinks and a white or 2 .

[bgl]

Justin,

You must have missed the part about "Island time" in the retirement thread! Seriously, if your plan is to drive around and buy all those plants and then also plant them all, in one week - not going to happen! I would suggest you buy as many of them as possible during the first couple of days and then plant whatever you feel like during the remainder of your stay. You can leave most plants/palms in pots for a LONG time, unattended. Not a problem. I have had palms in pots in our nursery area for years and I never water them.

Anyway, a few specific comments: even though you can get away with planting lots of palms in "full sun" (full exposure is really a better description because many days we don't have "full sun"), but there are a few exceptions. You should plant Marojejya and Kerriodoxa in partial shade. Ideally in among taller trees (ohi'a trees for instance) where they get the rain from above and the shade from the taller trees surrounding them.

Johannesteijsmannia: very temperamental - you plant 10. One or two will thrive, one or two will die and the rest will just hang in there. Some will be a bit bigger in ten years time, some will be a bit smaller. You just never know. Just planting one - you're taking your chances! Plus it needs partial shade.

Pseudophoenix: I don't even know if you can buy any of size here. But in any case, personally I wouldn't. About 97-98% of all palms will absolutely thrive here. Concentrate on those. The remaining 2-3% will either just hang in there and never look good OR they will die after a year or two. Pseudophoenix falls in the 2-3% category. I tried a few smaller ones (larger ones were not available) and they all died.

And yes, Hedyscepe will do just fine here. But it will be slow.

I think that was about it!

Bo-Göran

[bgl]

I just realized - you have no Tahina listed! My goal is to make Leilani Estates the Tahina capital of the world! There are already 8 or 9 properties here that either have Tahinas in the ground or will shortly be planting one. And none of them are on Maile Street!

[Dypsisdean]

Justin,

You sound like a very hungry man about to enter the buffet of a lifetime - with very "big eyes."

My advice to you would be to concentrate on palm/plants that you cannot grow (or grow well) in SoCal - especially if you plan on keeping that house. Of course there will be some exceptions, but even with 3 acres I have started to run out of room and have to make some hard choices and do some careful planning. When I visit my old SoCal garden, I like seeing the stuff that I don't see when I am here.

Along that same vein, do plan ahead. Leave some spots for the "new arrivals." Jeff M. is constantly bringing in new Pinangas, Licualas, Dypsis, etc. that you will want to have in your garden, but are only available in small sizes now. Buy them now and grow them up for later. These will be the new cutting edge palms that will make your garden unique.

And as has already been mentioned. Pay attention to those plants that can spread and become invasive. Until you have been here 2-3 years you won't appreciate how fast things can get out of hand. And that applies to even some of the pretty plants.

[daxin]

If you plan on any major hardscape work, it would be best to do that first, or at least reserve access space to minimize potential damage.

One suggestion is to add a rain canopy from the front door to the driveway. A lot of hotels in big cities have those, but you can make it more stylish and personal.

As for planting design, I agree with Peter in that more repetition and less species will look better. This is especially important for the front yard. Too many focal points will reduce their individual impacts.

I am also a big fan of fragrant plants such as Magnolia xAlba, Magnolia champaca, and Aglaia odorata. Some other representative tropical plants are Bread Fruit (Artocarpus altilis) and Traveler's Palm (Ravenala madagascarensis).

Once you have a canopy, I think you will have more fun filling in the space below with human-scale exotics that are more easily appreciated. Personally I'd start with foliage Anthuriums such as A. regale and A. warocqueanum. That big blood-red Alcantarea 'Merlot' that Bo planted a row in his old garden is not too shabby either.

You could also use cycads such as Bowenia spectabilis, Cycas debaoensis, and Zamia imperalis. Also check out Matonia pectinata, a fern species from Borneo that is unbelievably beautiful. This last one may be a little hard to find, but all the others should be available.

[Takil-Explorer]

Some Nepenthes would be nice there!

Alexander

[kahili]

I don't think that I would put Torch ginger in the island (or the psittacorum-as Ari suggests, too common and grows too fast). The torch is going to get 15' or higher and is going to block your view and appear large and overpowering in appearance. I think the island is too small to accommodate it. I would stick it out aways where you can see it from a distance-its going to be big enough to see! I also would put scented trees around the house. Not sure if anyone has suggested an ylang ylang tree (Cananga odorata) but I would plant one in a heartbeat if it were my property. I would also look at the Sambac jasmines for scents. In the island, pick a tree that you like the shape of and then stick with smaller plants that won't block the view of the tree, or the other areas. I think I would put some really cool and unusual smaller plants in the island-thats your centerpiece-what your eye is drawn to when you drive up and what you see when you come out your front door. Pick plants that aren't going to take over the whole bed while you are gone. I love Alocasia Sarian myself. Really yellow veins and stems that are similiar to Caryota zebrina, so you want it where you can see it up close.

I wouldn't put a tree fern up near the house. Its really common, and you will see them all over the place.

[bgl]

I was only paying attention to the palm names, but after reading kahili's response I must add my comment. Definitely agree about Etlingera/torch ginger. A bad invasive weed. Number one - yes, it WILL block the view. Number two - planting along the perimeter: may seem like a good plan. For the first six months or so. Then the plant will quickly take over the entire area and presumably crowd out anything else there. Should add that I don't know anything about the other plants mentioned so I don't know how strong they would be in defending themselves against the very aggressive growth of the Etlingera.

[Kim]

People don't plant much right close to the house on the wet side of Hawaii. There are good reasons for this -- insects such as ants and termites, and other critters, or so I am told. "Just outside the front door" should mean far enough away that the plants are not touching the house, or close to touching the house. While hand clearing parts of the garden, I have developed a new awe of vines and their rampant growth. Be sure you really want one and know exactly what to expect before it goes in the ground. It's been surprising to learn how many plants we admire in California that are noxious weeds in Hawaii, such as the H. psittacorum. Spacing of palms is an issue as well, because they will actually reach mature size at a rate we could never imagine in southern California, and it's possible to end up with more shade and density than you might have expected. My first three palms were planted in a triangle spaced 15 to 18 feet apart, and I wonder if that will be too close...

You are going to feel like a kid in a candy store, but heed Dean's advice and be very selective. Your garden will be fantastic, have a great time!

[Justin]

I would suggest some type of smallish, flowering tree(s) with nice scented flowers close to the house, such as Stemmadenia, Tabernaemonta, etc... And I would also suggest some type of Cassia- bakeriana, javanica, or a rainbow shower, also close by to look at. Then again, I love flowering trees. As for palms, I would also think about planting multiples of certain species, to give the garden some continuity, instead of trying to get one of everything. Repeating Clinostigmas samoense comes to mind. Also, even though I don't garden in the tropics, I've heard that gingers and heliconias can really take over, so if you're not going to be there all the time, you might take that into consideration. Someone from Hawaii can certainly correct me if I'm off base here. Exciting project!

I do intend to plant some more trees, Peter. I just haven't narrowed down my list as much as I have for the palms.

I will definitely plant multiples - sorry if that wasn't clear. Just because a plant was listed once doesn't mean that I intend to plant only one of it. I completely agree that continuity (and repetition) is necessary for a garden to look (more) natural.

[Justin]

I only know palm names, can't help with the rest.. If you have one week, you better be running off the plane with a shovel in your hand and cash flying out of your pockets!

And the post-hole digger. I concur that this is ambitious - it's not remotely expected that I'll plant all this stuff in one week. But what I do plant, I want to check to see if it's a bad idea. From some of the responses, there seem to be a couple things that I'll need to give more thought to.

[Justin]

Justin

Looks like a great selection of palms to plant . Did i miss it or have you not considered the beautiful Satakentia liukiuensis !.

Must be an amazing climate if you can grow Hedyscepe there as well as all the other tropicals.

Yes Troy, it's in post #2. I plan to have an area with a bunch of "pretty crownshaft" palms - so that when they get way to tall to see the fronds, I can at least admire the crownshafts.

[Justin]

Justin,

You must have missed the part about "Island time" in the retirement thread! Seriously, if your plan is to drive around and buy all those plants and then also plant them all, in one week - not going to happen! I would suggest you buy as many of them as possible during the first couple of days and then plant whatever you feel like during the remainder of your stay. You can leave most plants/palms in pots for a LONG time, unattended. Not a problem. I have had palms in pots in our nursery area for years and I never water them.

Anyway, a few specific comments: even though you can get away with planting lots of palms in "full sun" (full exposure is really a better description because many days we don't have "full sun"), but there are a few exceptions. You should plant Marojejya and Kerriodoxa in partial shade. Ideally in among taller trees (ohi'a trees for instance) where they get the rain from above and the shade from the taller trees surrounding them.

Johannesteijsmannia: very temperamental - you plant 10. One or two will thrive, one or two will die and the rest will just hang in there. Some will be a bit bigger in ten years time, some will be a bit smaller. You just never know. Just planting one - you're taking your chances! Plus it needs partial shade.

Pseudophoenix: I don't even know if you can buy any of size here. But in any case, personally I wouldn't. About 97-98% of all palms will absolutely thrive here. Concentrate on those. The remaining 2-3% will either just hang in there and never look good OR they will die after a year or two. Pseudophoenix falls in the 2-3% category. I tried a few smaller ones (larger ones were not available) and they all died.

And yes, Hedyscepe will do just fine here. But it will be slow.

I think that was about it!

Bo-Göran

Bo, I agree on timing. Purchasing is probably more important, as I can leave in pots. I was actually thinking that for some stuff, I could just put where I want planted, and have my property manager (or garden caretaker) plant for me. Obviously, I'd rather plant myself, but if time doesn't permit, that's the next best thing.

I also agree on Marojejya and Kerriodoxa, I was going to plant them in some of the shadier places, either under existing trees or on the north edge of existing landscaping.

On the Johannesteijsmannia, I was going to plant a handful and just let a couple of them - the best performing ones - take over. I do the same thing now at my Vista Garden with my proteas.

I had no idea about the Pseudophoenix being a poor performer - thanks for the head's up! This is the sort of information that I was hoping to get, to prevent me from making dumb mistakes. Thanks again.

[bgl]

Justin,

You're welcome! And my guess is that you're probably going to get more satisfaction out of planting the stuff yourself. Plus, makes me think of the expression: "if you want something done right, do it yourself".

About buying plants/palms - something else (that Dean indirectly brought up) is the issue of unusual stuff. When I moved here in 1995 I was initially renting and had decided not to buy any palms until after I had bought property. That quickly changed. What often happens is that you visit a nursery (Floribunda for instance) and you see an unusual palm. And there are only a handful left. And you think "if I don't buy now, they may all be gone next time". So you end up making interesting finds here and there, above and beyond what your "wish list" may contain.

About the Pseudophoenix: as I indicated above, it's a VERY small number of palms that won't perform well here. I call this the "perfect compromise climate". At an elevation of 800-900 ft it's cool enough that you can grow many of the palms that require cooler temperatures (Hedyscepe, Howea, Rhopalostylis for instance) but still warm enough that you can grow every single super tropical palm. The only ones that won't make it are the ones with very specific soil requirements (Maxburretia being in this group I believe) and those palms that absolutely cannot tolerate the high rainfall. I believe Jubaea is in that category. Not sure if Pseudophoenix falls in one or the other or maybe even both categories. Another genus that won't do well here: Ceroxylon (probably too wet). Only one exception (that I know of): C. amazonicum, which WILL perform well.

Bo-Göran

[Matt in SD]

I can't imagine having a garden in Hawaii without some of the prime tropical fruits. There are several Artocarpus species that are quite ornamental and have good fruit (marang for example, and of course breadfruit is a stunning tropical tree), Lychee trees are quite ornamental too in my opinion. And then there is Mangosteen and a whole ton of other Garcinia/Rheedia species that have delicious fruit and are very nice looking trees. And Durian is a good looking tree as well.

Otherwise your ideas all seem good to me. I'm not good thinking of whole planting areas at once...probably why I like to landscape over the course of years. I am always amazed at how landscapers can deal with a space in a short period of time. I like what I've done in my gardens, but it is a very slow process and I never could have planned them out from the start.

If you'r going to spend significant time there in the future (i.e. retirement) then you won't regret getting some fruit trees in the ground now.

Matt

[Peter]

What Matt said!

[Justin]

Matt, there are already a good amount of Fruit Trees there, and we will definitely be planting some more - already found a good nursery not too far away. Here's what is at the top of our list:

Citrofortunella microcarpa (Calimansi)

Mangifera indica (Mango)

Garcinia mangostana (Mangosteen)

Carica papaya (Papaya)

Nephelium lappaceum (Rambutan)

[Justin]

I just realized - you have no Tahina listed! My goal is to make Leilani Estates the Tahina capital of the world! There are already 8 or 9 properties here that either have Tahinas in the ground or will shortly be planting one. And none of them are on Maile Street!

Bo, how large will will a Tahina get relative to a Corypha? Perhaps I could plant one instead of the other?

[Justin]

Justin,

You sound like a very hungry man about to enter the buffet of a lifetime - with very "big eyes."

My advice to you would be to concentrate on palm/plants that you cannot grow (or grow well) in SoCal - especially if you plan on keeping that house. Of course there will be some exceptions, but even with 3 acres I have started to run out of room and have to make some hard choices and do some careful planning. When I visit my old SoCal garden, I like seeing the stuff that I don't see when I am here.

Along that same vein, do plan ahead. Leave some spots for the "new arrivals." Jeff M. is constantly bringing in new Pinangas, Licualas, Dypsis, etc. that you will want to have in your garden, but are only available in small sizes now. Buy them now and grow them up for later. These will be the new cutting edge palms that will make your garden unique.

And as has already been mentioned. Pay attention to those plants that can spread and become invasive. Until you have been here 2-3 years you won't appreciate how fast things can get out of hand. And that applies to even some of the pretty plants.

Dean, I am in 100% agreement on the "Hawaii Garden" and the "California Garden." I have already taken a number of things off my list for my Vista Garden, figuring they'll grow better in Hawaii. And as you can see, there is some stuff I've already thought of removing in Hawaii, such as the Jacaranda (which looks much better in California). My Vista Garden has a ton of Proteaceae, which won't grow at all in Hawaii (at least not on the windward side, at low elevations).

I will leave spots open for new arrivals, but in addition, I am hoping to purchase the empty lot next door. If I manage to get my hands on that, I'll have a whole new canvas to work with, one that's not nearly so open and bright.

[bgl]

Well, a Corypha WILL get larger, but it'll take a long time. The Tahina of course is a very large palm as well (eventually!). And how long it's going to take to get "large" is anyone's guess but I can tell you one thing with absolute certainty: growing from from seedlings, the Tahina is a very robust grower with a new frond every couple of months. Coryphas are VERY iffy as seedlings. They can sit there for YEARS and do next to nothing. And you will not be able to find a larger Corypha here.

[Justin]

If you plan on any major hardscape work, it would be best to do that first, or at least reserve access space to minimize potential damage.

One suggestion is to add a rain canopy from the front door to the driveway. A lot of hotels in big cities have those, but you can make it more stylish and personal.

As for planting design, I agree with Peter in that more repetition and less species will look better. This is especially important for the front yard. Too many focal points will reduce their individual impacts.

I am also a big fan of fragrant plants such as Magnolia xAlba, Magnolia champaca, and Aglaia odorata. Some other representative tropical plants are Bread Fruit (Artocarpus altilis) and Traveler's Palm (Ravenala madagascarensis).

Once you have a canopy, I think you will have more fun filling in the space below with human-scale exotics that are more easily appreciated. Personally I'd start with foliage Anthuriums such as A. regale and A. warocqueanum. That big blood-red Alcantarea 'Merlot' that Bo planted a row in his old garden is not too shabby either.

You could also use cycads such as Bowenia spectabilis, Cycas debaoensis, and Zamia imperalis. Also check out Matonia pectinata, a fern species from Borneo that is unbelievably beautiful. This last one may be a little hard to find, but all the others should be available.

I don't plan any hardscape work - the yard has too much hardscape as it is, in my opinion. But point taken.

On the Anthuriums, I agree. I saw a bunch of cool Anthuriums, Philodendrons, Alocasias, etc. at Dean's place, and I need to go back (assuming Dean lets me ) and write down species names for the ones I like the most.

[Justin]

I don't think that I would put Torch ginger in the island (or the psittacorum-as Ari suggests, too common and grows too fast). The torch is going to get 15' or higher and is going to block your view and appear large and overpowering in appearance. I think the island is too small to accommodate it. I would stick it out aways where you can see it from a distance-its going to be big enough to see! I also would put scented trees around the house. Not sure if anyone has suggested an ylang ylang tree (Cananga odorata) but I would plant one in a heartbeat if it were my property. I would also look at the Sambac jasmines for scents. In the island, pick a tree that you like the shape of and then stick with smaller plants that won't block the view of the tree, or the other areas. I think I would put some really cool and unusual smaller plants in the island-thats your centerpiece-what your eye is drawn to when you drive up and what you see when you come out your front door. Pick plants that aren't going to take over the whole bed while you are gone. I love Alocasia Sarian myself. Really yellow veins and stems that are similiar to Caryota zebrina, so you want it where you can see it up close.

I wouldn't put a tree fern up near the house. Its really common, and you will see them all over the place.

This is very good advice, thank you. I will plan to put the Etlingeras on the north side of the addition (which is 2 stories tall and where the Master Bedroom is), and look down on them (or maybe straight out at them) from there. That's where I was planning to put the tall Heliconias as well.

Lots of suggestions for fragrant plants - I'll have to take a look at all of these and choose a couple.

Thanks!

[ariscott]

I have to disagree on Etlingera. It is very prolific grower, yes... but I wouldn't call it invasive - even in Cairns. It is easy enough to control & easy enough to remove, if you need to. And they are absolutely beautiful!! In general, heliconias & gingers are higher maintenance plants than palms or trees. You do have to clean them up. But the rewards are worth it!! I have about 20 different types of heliconias growing and a few different types of gingers (Etlingera, alpinia, beehive, cucurma, a few costus - so I should know what I am talking about - I hope). So, it will all depend on how much work you are willing to put in. Good luck.

I have been thinking about that roundabout of yours... what about putting in Browneopsis in the middle. Faster & hardier than amherstia & absolutely beautiful. And you definitely need to plant trees for canopy of those ultra tropical shade palms like Joey.

Corypha are faster in the ground. My corypha has exploded in the last 2 year. They didn't do anything in the first year. I planted them as 3 leaves seedling (strap leaves). I think they need the heat to grow faster... I wonder whether that is the problem with Hawaii???

Regards, Ari

[kahili]

Ari-I wouldn't have called torch ginger invasive myself-but the red and pink are huge plants when established and I just think that they would be better off where they can have some room to grow, where they are not growing into other plants. That island bed is really small for such a huge plant that is not even a real clumper-it is a spreader. I would hate to have to cut back the stems constantly and dispose of them! I do love them-its really awesome the way that the blooms grow right out of the ground. You could literally use one as a club.

Although most of the gingers are fairly easy to remove, white/yellow ginger (hedychium) takes awhile to remove all the way should you decide to. I had a clump outside the front of my house that I wanted to move as it was getting way out hand and it took forever. You just never get all the rhizomes. I would consider that a weed of sorts, even though it smells so good.

What about Stricta 'Sharonii'? That is a really cool heliconia in that the backs of the leaves are solid maroon. Very few of the heliconas have unusual leaves, and this one is a prolific bloomer and I think will stay fairly small as a clump. That would do well in the island if you wanted heliconia in there.

[bgl]

Actually I would call it invasive. I have seen first hand what a Torch ginger can do, and it's not pretty. I had a 5-6 ft tall Pritchardia. Somehow this Torch ginger showed up - have no idea where it came from and I most certainly did not plant it. In no time flat it had surrounded and crowded out the Pritchardia. There was no way to dig it out. Its fate was sealed one way or another so I just left it there to be strangled by the Torch ginger. Which is what happened. I would not plant a Torch ginger ANYWHERE near any small to medium sized palm because I have seen what happens!

[Justin]

Very interesting anecdote, Bo. Sounds like it almost needs to be treated like Bamboo.

[bgl]

It grows like running bamboo and needs to be treated accordingly. You plant it in one place and it will show up in another, nearby, place VERY quickly. The roots are going to be all over the place before you know it!